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Old 10-12-2017, 21:12   #3021
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Has Stan Collymore sneaked on here under a false name? To be fair, I don't think that we were great today, but we have been at times this season.

Ederson got lucky with his first save in that it hit him in the face, and it could easily have been a draw, but overall I think that we deserved the win. Until we got the ball down in the corner, we'd looked ragged for 10 minutes and I thought that had United been more positive from the off, they might have got something from today.
Kind of my point though. A better team would have given you a game today.
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Old 13-12-2017, 21:52   #3022
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I've no idea if anyone watched this tonight. But if you did, I share your pain.

Absolute drivel. Long ball drivel, at that.
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Old 13-12-2017, 22:44   #3023
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I've no idea if anyone watched this tonight. But if you did, I share your pain.

Absolute drivel. Long ball drivel, at that.
I never watched it, but as the match was being played I listened to a report on the radio & the guy was well ****** off at the way we were playing. Four & a half years after Sir Alex retired & we still are no further forward than when Moyes was with us (notice he could beat Chelsea).... & no I don't want him back. We need a better manager, better scouts & a better team. This is now getting ridiculous.
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Old 13-12-2017, 23:06   #3024
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I never watched it, but as the match was being played I listened to a report on the radio & the guy was well ****** off at the way we were playing. Four & a half years after Sir Alex retired & we still are no further forward than when Moyes was with us (notice he could beat Chelsea).... & no I don't want him back. We need a better manager, better scouts & a better team. This is now getting ridiculous.
We need a better chief executive (or whatever position that **** Woodward holds) and better owners.
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Old 13-12-2017, 23:13   #3025
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We need a better chief executive (or whatever position that **** Woodward holds) and better owners.
Yes, I would second that.
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Old 13-12-2017, 23:32   #3026
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I never watched it, but as the match was being played I listened to a report on the radio & the guy was well ****** off at the way we were playing. Four & a half years after Sir Alex retired & we still are no further forward than when Moyes was with us (notice he could beat Chelsea).... & no I don't want him back. We need a better manager, better scouts & a better team. This is now getting ridiculous.


Your constant winging is getting ridiculous. Moyes couldn’t beat an egg when he was our manager. Don’t always have to win pretty, if we are so bad, then the other 18 clubs in the league might as well pack it in right now. Are we better than they team who finished seventh, yes seventh, of course we are.


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Old 14-12-2017, 06:33   #3027
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I never watched it, but as the match was being played I listened to a report on the radio & the guy was well ****** off at the way we were playing. Four & a half years after Sir Alex retired & we still are no further forward than when Moyes was with us (notice he could beat Chelsea).... & no I don't want him back. We need a better manager, better scouts & a better team. This is now getting ridiculous.
Maybe you should have stuck with him and accepted it was a long term thing.

You seem to have paid the price for short termism
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Old 14-12-2017, 07:41   #3028
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Maybe you should have stuck with him and accepted it was a long term thing.

You seem to have paid the price for short termism
Moyes was woefully out of his depth.
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Old 14-12-2017, 11:21   #3029
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Your constant winging is getting ridiculous. Moyes couldn’t beat an egg when he was our manager. Don’t always have to win pretty, if we are so bad, then the other 18 clubs in the league might as well pack it in right now. Are we better than they team who finished seventh, yes seventh, of course we are.


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NO. I am constantly saying what needs to be said. After Four & a half years I expect United to be playing like city are playing. Not defending & hoofing. We are an embarrasment. What I am saying is echoed , 'AND SOME' by almost every where I listen, view & read. Only brain dead people can not see what is happening. The teams below us all have less money than us with chelsea having a mealticket. We are still the richest club in the world. Let me tell you this, if Real Madrid, Barcelona etc had been in the position we are in for four & a half years you would hear REAL WINGING, but they don't have stupid fans who say everything is OK when it clearly aint.
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Old 14-12-2017, 11:23   #3030
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Moyes was woefully out of his depth.
He was, but you can't change the fact that he recently beat chelsea with a very weak team, & we lost to chelsea with half a billion pounds worth of players & Mourhino. I don't like it, but it is fact.
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Old 14-12-2017, 11:28   #3031
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He was, but you can't change the fact that he recently beat chelsea with a very weak team, & we lost to chelsea with half a billion pounds worth of players & Mourhino. I don't like it, but it is fact.
one result. one.

I also can't believe LVG saying that United are playing 'boring football' with a straight face (although does he have anything but a straight face?). Has he watched any videos of his time at United?? At least we currently play the ball towards the opponent's goal nowadays!

The biggest loss to United over the last 5 years wasn't SAF, it was David Gill, imo.
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Old 14-12-2017, 11:42   #3032
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NO. I am constantly saying what needs to be said. After Four & a half years I expect United to be playing like city are playing. Not defending & hoofing. We are an embarrasment. What I am saying is echoed , 'AND SOME' by almost every where I listen, view & read. Only brain dead people can not see what is happening. The teams below us all have less money than us with chelsea having a mealticket. We are still the richest club in the world. Let me tell you this, if Real Madrid, Barcelona etc had been in the position we are in for four & a half years you would hear REAL WINGING, but they don't have stupid fans who say everything is OK when it clearly aint.


I broadly agree with what you say here. What I completely disagree with is your constant claim that we have not progressed since Moyes (who nearly single handedly destroyed our club), which simply isn’t true. I’m not saying we are a great team at the moment, or we are where we all want to be - but we are progressing, and we are without doubt far better than under Moyes.


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Old 14-12-2017, 12:09   #3033
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After Four & a half years I expect United to be playing like city are playing. Not defending & hoofing.
Fair play to you MICON; I never thought that I'd see the day when a United fan would say this in the United thread.

Yes, City have had plenty of money to spend and have by far the best squad in the league, but the manager still makes a difference. I thought that Mancini did a good job and so did Pellegrini in his first season, but the transformation brought about by Pep is astounding. The answer is not money on it's own - to be competing now you need MONEY + A GOOD MANAGER + TIME.

Last season, Pep got a rough ride, but we wouldn't be playing the way we are now if all of the squad hadn't gone through that learning process last season. You could see it all starting to click in the last six games of last season.

I think that Mourinho has been a great manager (for Chelsea and others) - he's still a competent manager now, but I don't think that he will return United to greatness. Playing hoofball may get them into the Champions League next year, but it probably won't win any major trophies.
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Old 14-12-2017, 12:13   #3034
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The answer is not money on it's own - to be competing now you need MONEY + A GOOD MANAGER + TIME.
Also, a good manager costs a bit too.

You also need the guys above the manager who can actually get the job done, who can sign the players that the manager wants or needs.

We don't currently have that either.
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Old 14-12-2017, 12:21   #3035
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Also, a good manager costs a bit too.

You also need the guys above the manager who can actually get the job done, who can sign the players that the manager wants or needs.

We don't currently have that either.


Jose along with Pep have to be the highest paid managers in the world.

Woodward has brought in Bailly, Lindelof, Matic, Pogba, Miki, Zlatan and Lukaku in two summers on behalf of the manager - how much money is that - about £300m!! We know Jose wanted the Croatian winger from Inter - but that’s all we seem to have missed out on, because they wanted £50m for a 28/29 year old.

What more should Woodward be doing? Who else should he have bought?


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Old 14-12-2017, 12:29   #3036
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Jose along with Pep have to be the highest paid managers in the world.

Woodward has brought in Bailly, Lindelof, Matic, Pogba, Miki, Zlatan and Lukaku in two summers on behalf of the manager - how much money is that - about £300m!! We know Jose wanted the Croatian winger from Inter - but that’s all we seem to have missed out on, because they wanted £50m for a 28/29 year old.

What more should Woodward be doing? Who else should he have bought?


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Players that were approached, wanted and Woodward failed to sign, before Mourinho came in :

Dani Alves, Nicolas Otamendi, Mats Hummels, Leighton Baines, Arturo Vidal, Thiago Alcantara, Cesc Fabregas, Toni Kroos, Gareth Bale (multiple times!), Pedro, Thomas Muller, I'm sure there are more.

Sure, some of these decided to go elsewhere or stay, but it's Woodward's job to convince them.

Some of the ones you named are José old boys who would have been swayed by the manager, regardless of Woodward.
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Old 14-12-2017, 12:40   #3037
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Players that were approached, wanted and Woodward failed to sign, before Mourinho came in :

Dani Alves, Nicolas Otamendi, Mats Hummels, Leighton Baines, Arturo Vidal, Thiago Alcantara, Cesc Fabregas, Toni Kroos, Gareth Bale (multiple times!), Pedro, Thomas Muller, I'm sure there are more.

Sure, some of these decided to go elsewhere or stay, but it's Woodward's job to convince them.

Some of the ones you named are José old boys who would have been swayed by the manager, regardless of Woodward.


Anyone approached whilst Moyes was in charge can be dismissed (no class player would want to work for that idiot), also how much of that is paper talk. Of course the manager has a massive impact on getting players in, RVP would never had come to us if it wasn’t for Fergie, that had nothing to do with Gill.

Do you really blame Woodward for not signing Muller - utterly no chance or Bale whose heart was set on Madrid. You’ve looked at the Moyes/ LVG era, but ignored Jose’s.

So even if we missed out on a load of targets pre Jose, surely Woodward has done pretty much what Jose wanted over the past 18 months? What about Pogba and Zlatan with no CL that year?


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Old 14-12-2017, 12:48   #3038
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Raphael Varane, Renato Sanches and the aforementioned Ivan Perišić under Mourinho.
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Old 14-12-2017, 16:07   #3039
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I'm going to be honest, MICON makes a fair point. Fergie left us at the top, and we've taken more time to get back to being 'close' than City have taken to become far and away the best.

Year on year we're improving. But it's from a pretty low point, and there has been at least two of those years where we've stood still. Watching us against Huddersfield was easily as bad as anything under LVG. I think Mourinho is getting us there - we're certainly better than last year - but as we creep towards getting better, the rival clubs are making strides.

It doesn't help that the standard of Premier League teams is getting worse as well. City are beatable, but the competition from the likes of the Arsenals and Spurs, even the clubs in the middle like Burnley, Liverpool and Everton, it's just not as good as it used to be.
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Old 14-12-2017, 17:57   #3040
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Wasn't it a surprise in Fergie's last season when we won? City had a hangover season and the team we had was an aging shadow of former United squads.

Who knows, if Moyes had taken over when Fergie had originally planned to go, he may have done better. Or just had longer to turn us into a new 'dogs of war'.

It's not good enough at the moment (performance wise, rather than results), but it's better so far than the last 3 seasons.
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