Go Back   Forums @ The Digital Fix > Entertainment Discussion Forums > Sports Forum

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 16-04-2019, 08:15   #121
jockosjungle
formerly rbullivant
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Warrington
Posts: 22,203
Thanks: 277
Thanked 1,123 Times in 794 Posts
Isn't it general wisdom that two cars fighting each other are generally slower anyway, so I'm guessing that is part of it
jockosjungle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 08:21   #122
nutter45
burninator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: London
Posts: 9,122
Thanks: 638
Thanked 284 Times in 193 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rooster View Post
He wasn’t slower . He actually pulled out a few secs a couple of times but gave it back with two lock ups .

He definitely was slower, they said it during the race and the stats bear it out. But I know you don’t like stats or facts

There was no point LeClerc sitting in DRS range dirty air as Ferrari wouldn’t have let him past.
nutter45 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 10:45   #123
RonnyJ
NO TOUCHING!
 
RonnyJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Norwich
Posts: 4,246
Thanks: 7
Thanked 20 Times in 13 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jockosjungle View Post
Isn't it general wisdom that two cars fighting each other are generally slower anyway, so I'm guessing that is part of it
Usually, yes, though since they were both slower after Vettel passed and the fighting between them stopped, that further damages any argument that Vettel was the faster driver at the time.
RonnyJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 11:34   #124
rooster
Pig Farm Owner
 
rooster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: edinburgh
Posts: 3,375
Thanks: 62
Thanked 74 Times in 56 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutter45 View Post
He definitely was slower, they said it during the race and the stats bear it out. But I know you don’t like stats or facts

There was no point LeClerc sitting in DRS range dirty air as Ferrari wouldn’t have let him past.
The only thing the stats bear out is who ever was in front was faster on majority of laps. When leclerc was in front he was fastest on most laps but not all but only by hundredths of a sec in the main. This flipped when Vettel was in front. Vettel was not slower
rooster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 11:52   #125
RonnyJ
NO TOUCHING!
 
RonnyJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Norwich
Posts: 4,246
Thanks: 7
Thanked 20 Times in 13 Posts
Vettel's lap times in front of Leclerc were slower than Leclerc's lap times in front of Vettel. It's hard to argue against that, because that's exactly what the numbers show.

That's the only data we can analyse, since there's no point considering the gap behind of a driver who has just obeyed a team order.
RonnyJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 12:24   #126
jockosjungle
formerly rbullivant
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Warrington
Posts: 22,203
Thanks: 277
Thanked 1,123 Times in 794 Posts
Everything is being said in retrospect though isn't it? Judgement calls and so forth, they can either be a masterstroke or a disaster.
jockosjungle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 12:36   #127
nutter45
burninator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: London
Posts: 9,122
Thanks: 638
Thanked 284 Times in 193 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rooster View Post
The only thing the stats bear out is who ever was in front was faster on majority of laps. When leclerc was in front he was fastest on most laps but not all but only by hundredths of a sec in the main. This flipped when Vettel was in front. Vettel was not slower

This is plain wrong. The quote is above to disprove.

If you want to believe some fictional alternative, as is your wont, you carry on.
nutter45 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 14:48   #128
rooster
Pig Farm Owner
 
rooster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: edinburgh
Posts: 3,375
Thanks: 62
Thanked 74 Times in 56 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutter45 View Post
This is plain wrong. The quote is above to disprove.

If you want to believe some fictional alternative, as is your wont, you carry on.
Have a look at lap times mate everything ive said is right and fact . You get all your info from bbc quotes rather than looking at real data.
rooster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 14:51   #129
rooster
Pig Farm Owner
 
rooster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: edinburgh
Posts: 3,375
Thanks: 62
Thanked 74 Times in 56 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnyJ View Post
Vettel's lap times in front of Leclerc were slower than Leclerc's lap times in front of Vettel. It's hard to argue against that, because that's exactly what the numbers show.

That's the only data we can analyse, since there's no point considering the gap behind of a driver who has just obeyed a team order.

Even you know as tyres degrade everyone gets slower. The only number that is relative is to each other. The numbers show whoever was in lead they went faster than the other. The cars were very very close. i.e. Vettel was not slower . Ferrari had every right to let him through to see if he was quicker . Don't let your hatred of Vettel blur what really happened.
rooster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 16:59   #130
RonnyJ
NO TOUCHING!
 
RonnyJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Norwich
Posts: 4,246
Thanks: 7
Thanked 20 Times in 13 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rooster View Post
Even you know as tyres degrade everyone gets slower. The only number that is relative is to each other. The numbers show whoever was in lead they went faster than the other. The cars were very very close. i.e. Vettel was not slower . Ferrari had every right to let him through to see if he was quicker . Don't let your hatred of Vettel blur what really happened.
I hardly think stating a fact shows a "hatred of Vettel". Their lap times dropped approximately half a second after the swap, which seems an entirely reasonable fact to point out within a discussion about imposing team orders between two drivers.

And, yes, tyres do indeed degrade. Whether an approximate half-second drop in pace after the switch was due to sudden tyre degradation, or Vettel no longer having DRS, or another reason entirely, only Ferrari can answer.
RonnyJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 18:15   #131
rooster
Pig Farm Owner
 
rooster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: edinburgh
Posts: 3,375
Thanks: 62
Thanked 74 Times in 56 Posts
My point is putting forward slower lap times after the swap as ‘proof’ that vettel was slower is flawed . Hamilton and Verstappen were also slower by 0.5 secs roughly after lap 11 up till tyre change . Degrading tyres is obviously the reason .
rooster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2019, 18:19   #132
MaxNutter
20
 
MaxNutter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Timperley
Posts: 14,932
Thanks: 146
Thanked 517 Times in 338 Posts
There's also an argument that Vettel was faster, but Ferrari waited too long to do the switch and having spent too long in LeClerc's dirty air his advantage was lost.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
__________________
"He has his mother's eyes..."
"I thought we had them?"
MaxNutter is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New US TV Shows 2019 TonyG Television Discussion 42 08-04-2019 18:24
The KISS thread: End of the Road Tour in 2019? MrSpeed Music Discussion 762 21-03-2019 13:23
Oscars 2019 Arthur Fowler Film Discussion 36 26-02-2019 12:16
Toshiba 2019 and RCE robbiez666 Home Entertainment Hardware forum 1 04-06-2004 13:01

All times are GMT. The time now is 15:28.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2000 - 2018 Poisonous Monkey Ltd. Part of The Digital Fix Network