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Old 01-07-2008, 21:35   #61
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raw is now for the young talent

Batista???





I'm still looking for the catch in all this. A bad habit after so many years.
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:15   #62
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a new ear has begun?
Pardon???

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Old 02-07-2008, 18:12   #63
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a new ear has begun?
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Pardon???




Foley?
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Old 17-07-2008, 00:17   #64
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Old 17-07-2008, 16:01   #65
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what?
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Old 17-07-2008, 16:03   #66
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I think it's in response to Monday's RAW????
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Old 17-07-2008, 16:20   #67
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I think it's in response to Monday's RAW????


Apparently Batista squashed Punk in a dark match after the show went off the air. The booking of Punk as champion has been horrible so far. I'd seriously consider turning him heel, as he comes across as a bit of a wuss as a face.
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Old 17-07-2008, 16:25   #68
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Ah... I'd heard that.

I saw a bit from the end of it after Dave had saved him from Kane and didn't shake Punk's hand. Punk said something along the lines of "don't put your hands on me" and shoved him before Dave hit him with a spinebuster. Punk was very slightly heel-ish when he said it. Perhaps they could continue it from there?
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Old 17-07-2008, 17:11   #69
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Heels are ALWAYS more interesting...discuss!
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Old 17-07-2008, 17:14   #70
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Heels are ALWAYS more interesting...discuss!

I'm starting to think that there aren't faces any more. There's just heels, "cool" heels (the artists formerly known as faces), and jobbers.
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Old 18-07-2008, 10:47   #71
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Sigh..true. It was much better when you had good, cowardly heels. The likes of Honky Tonk Man, Ravishing Rick Rude and countless others will never be seen again
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Old 18-07-2008, 11:42   #72
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Sigh..true. It was much better when you had good, cowardly heels. The likes of Honky Tonk Man, Ravishing Rick Rude and countless others will never be seen again


So true. I've been watching the Championship Wrestling tv show (which eventually become Superstars of Wrestling) from 1984, and its in a different league to the stuff we get now. Roddy Piper and David Schultz in their prime are two of the greatest heels you'll see.

The funny thing is that they release a lot of historical DVDs these days (Flair, the Horsemen, AWA, World Class, etc), and its almost like they're saying "here you go. this is when wrestling was actually good".
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Old 18-07-2008, 11:44   #73
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Oh come on guys JBL is Poopy was a stroke of genius
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Old 18-07-2008, 12:10   #74
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So true. I've been watching the Championship Wrestling tv show (which eventually become Superstars of Wrestling) from 1984, and its in a different league to the stuff we get now. Roddy Piper and David Schultz in their prime are two of the greatest heels you'll see.

The funny thing is that they release a lot of historical DVDs these days (Flair, the Horsemen, AWA, World Class, etc), and its almost like they're saying "here you go. this is when wrestling was actually good".
Absolutely - the only wrestling I watch these days is on dvd (working my way through The Rock's dvd set at the mo) and the WWE retro show on Sunday morning.

Back in the 80s/90s, even the crap heels (Rick Martel, Paul Roma etc) were good. You don't get as much heat portraying yourself as a badass as you do as an arrogant cowardly heel.

Of the current crop, only Edge and maybe Jericho are believable heels and good at it too.

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Old 18-07-2008, 12:19   #75
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I think the reason that mid-carders (like Martel and Roma) got over back then was because of the squash match. Everyone looked dominant on tv, because they were just battering Barry Horowitz or Duane Gill for 3 minutes. You never actually saw them get killed by Warrior, Undertaker, etc until a pay per view. These days, they all get chokelsammed by Big Show or Kane on a weekly basis, so no-one gets over.

One thing I'll never understand though is why they stopped using managers. Heenan, Jimmy Hart, Slick, etc were brillaint at getting over those who weren't great talkers. Larry Sweeney in ROH is proof that there's still a place for them.
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Old 18-07-2008, 12:27   #76
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To go back to the current state of Raw. I suspect that Regal will return as GM on Monday to restart his 'respect me' angle that was curtailed when he had his 60 day ban.
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Old 19-07-2008, 17:22   #77
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I really like the fact that, despite WWE's best efforts, Punk is pulling the big ratings and making it very difficult to take the belt off him

Have also been liking Smackdown the last few weeks. They really do seem to be making an effort and with HHH & Edge on top it almost seems like the A show at this point. The wedding reception was hilarious.
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Old 21-07-2008, 09:18   #78
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Back in the 80s/90s, even the crap heels (Rick Martel, Paul Roma etc) were good. You don't get as much heat portraying yourself as a badass as you do as an arrogant cowardly heel.
Disagree over Martel, he was a fantastic heel and a great technical wrestler to boot. And his entrancewith his huge bottle of aftershave ("arrogance") was fantastic.

His match with Shawn Michaels were they both agreed not to hit each other in the face was one my favourites
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Old 21-07-2008, 10:33   #79
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Well Martel was nothing more than a mid-carder, having been AWA champion (I think I'm right here).

The bottom line is that there was a definition between heels and faces. That and the fact that the heels weren't afraid to be seen as cowardly made for some great entertainment. These days the line is blurred and there is a need to be seen as a heel badass all the time. Maybe you could blame HHH and the Clique for that as it was where it seemed to start.

Managers could also add a myriad of booking ideas. Hooking a leg/outside interference as well as handling interviews etc. Even something simple as a manager turfing out an old tag team to manage a new one would lead to credible matches for months afterwards!

Is wrestling better today without the likes of Mr Perfect, the Fabulous Rougeau Brothers etc? Definitely not IMO and it's one of the reasons why I don't watch the modern product.. Now back to Youtube for other golden clips!
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Old 21-07-2008, 12:56   #80
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His match with Shawn Michaels were they both agreed not to hit each other in the face was one my favourites
Summerslam '92 at Wembley Stadium iirc.....
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