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Old 21-06-2018, 23:20   #581
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Finally saw this. I didnt think much of it at all. It was very bland.

I found a lot of things didnt make sense. What was the point of trains when you have vehicles that dont need to touch the ground? It felt like it was created in the script because they wanted a train robbery.

There was no emotion in the film. Woody lost his woman and he just carries on five minutes later.

Solo fighting Vision at the end was rubbish. He has a gun, but somehow the bad guy is waving a knife around.

The leads were all fine, but the film had no heart.

I'd moan more, but I'm tired.

I wont watch this again. For the record, liked RO a lot, TFA, didnt like TLJ
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Old 22-06-2018, 05:55   #582
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On the trains, presumably it is efficiency. Flying is expensive, which is why we don't all fly everywhere now. But I see your point. It was probably deemed more efficient than riding round on giant lizards like they did in the prequels
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Old 22-06-2018, 05:57   #583
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Now they are saying that they are sticking with established directors. How many movies do you have to have under your belt to be considered established 2,4, 10? Was Ron Howard not an established director? it didn't turn out to well for him either.
Who is that a dig at? Rian Johnson?
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Old 22-06-2018, 07:49   #584
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That's all we get from people saying it was good. They never say why.
The viewpoint character of George Lucas’s original Star Wars trilogy, Hamill’s Luke suffered somewhat – upstaged by his cooler friends and relations, removed from the happy ending allotted to Princess Leia (Luke’s putative love interest, until she turned out to be his sister) and Han Solo, and shunted off to be the equivalent of a hermit monk while the rest of the galaxy far, far away got on with business. While Harrison Ford became a major movie star/grouch icon and Carrie Fisher a notable writer/wit, Hamill was wandering through low-rent stuff like The Guyver (1991), Time Runner (1993) and the remake of Village of the Damned (1995), doing his most impassioned work as the demented voice of the Joker on various animated Batman projects.

For Hamill and Luke, Rian Johnson’s entry in the long-running series (given the pastiche of chapter-play format, it should perhaps be labelled a serial) is a belated opportunity to get their due. Glimpsed at the end of J.J. Abrams’s Star Wars The Force Awakens (2015), Hamill finally dominates a Star Wars film as a grizzled, regretful presence – a former apprentice turned master, contemplating his many failures yet returning with the grey gone from his beard for a climax in which he stands up to a ridiculously overwhelming attack (“Fire every gun we have at that man,” snarls his nephew-nemesis) and departs mysteriously. The previous instalment was a last hurrah for Ford in this universe – though Han Solo is due back in a prequel next year – but this is all about Hamill, with a side reverence for the genuinely departed Carrie Fisher (who cedes a little space to Laura Dern’s chic Vice Admiral Holdo).
It’s a valedictory entry, as obviously patterned on The Empire Strikes Back as The Force Awakens was on Star Wars (1977), though Johnson plays more tricks on long-term fans who think they can detect where character arcs are going. In Empire, Luke and his master Yoda are separated from the rest of the gang on a spiritual retreat/training exercise; here, Daisy Ridley’s Rey nags the reluctant master to school her in the ways of the Force, while a large cast of old and new friends and enemies struggle through their own subplots and a great many awe-inspiring explosions.

Like Empire, this chronicles a disastrous period for the Resistance – a term, incidentally, taken from The Force Awakens and embraced by real-world critics of President Trump – because penultimate episodes must take us to the brink of disaster before a valiant rally in the final chapter. All the heroes’ plans fail – which means John Boyega and new face Kelly Marie Tran spend most of the film haring down a plot cul-de-sac – and the cause of good only avoids extermination by kamikaze gestures.

There’s plenty of emotion and spectacle, with Adam Driver’s Ben Solo/Kylo Ren the most complicated character in the entire saga, and a terrific final skirmish on a planet whose salty white topsoil churns to reveal blood-red dirt as men and machines scramble against each other. Johnson, unlike Abrams or Gareth Edwards in the 2016 flashback entry Rogue One, leavens political high seriousness and fan-service tear-jerking with enough charm and humour to prevent The Last Jedi becoming the biggest downer ever delivered at Christmas by the Walt Disney Company.

Star Wars has a poor track record with cuteness and comedy – no one is clamouring for the return of the Ewoks or Jar Jar – but the guinea pig/penguin/puffin-like Porgs, natives of Skywalker’s island retreat, infest odd corners of the film (and the Millennium Falcon) without becoming cloying. The neatest inside joke has what seems to be a shot of a landing spaceship turn out to be a steam iron, paying back a ribbing administered long ago and far away in the first and best of the Star Wars parodies, Ernie Fosselius’s short Hardware Wars (1978).
At one point, Johnson – probably the best director to sign up for the franchise and certainly the best writer-director – has droid R2D2 spur on a disconsolate Luke by replaying the ‘you’re my only hope’ holo-message from Leia that kicked off the whole saga in Star Wars. It’s an achievement that this particular tale of defeat and death – by the end of the film, the entire rebel alliance can fit in one small spaceship – can convincingly deliver its own spark of hope… an abused stable boy on a backwater world, head full of the tales of Luke Skywalker, plays with a broom as if it were a light sabre, and looks to the stars for adventure in a just cause.
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Old 22-06-2018, 08:06   #585
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Is your name Kim Newman?
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Old 22-06-2018, 08:25   #586
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Is your name Kim Newman?
On a Friday, yes.
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Old 22-06-2018, 08:29   #587
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I was hoping to have a decent conversation about it but instead you prefered to come across as a complete tool. But whatever
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Old 22-06-2018, 08:52   #588
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Originally Posted by lentini View Post
He flys and owns a T16 plus his piloting skills are mentioned by two characters.



Time passes between Empire and Jedi, around a year I believe.
So really it seems that the new films could just do with a little bit more exposition in the dialogue and some room to breathe in the time line. I can see that as a reasonable point of view. I would be more than happy to have level headed conversations about things like that but the moment the pathetic whining drivel about "SJWs", "Mary Sues" and "feminist agendas" rears its ugly head I have absolutely no interest any more.
Funnily enough I've never heard any of these terms in real life conversations; only on the internet! Even the only friend of mine that absolutely hated TLJ did not point to any of these as being reasons for not liking it.

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Old 22-06-2018, 09:12   #589
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So really it seems that the new films could just do with a little bit more exposition in the dialogue and some room to breathe in the time line. I can see that as a reasonable point of view.
Yes, the fact that she has an instant perfect skillset for everything she does because plot. For instance, I watched Episode IV last night and Luke (and pretty much everyone) isn't a good shot with blasters. Every firefight is back a forth with missed shots and ducking into cover. Rey in The Force Awakens takes one shot with that small blaster that Han gives her and suddenly can take out two Stormtroopers with pinpoint accuracy. If the film showed he character actually developing throughout both films she'd be far more interesting.


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I would be more than happy to have level headed conversations about things like that but the moment the pathetic whining drivel about "SJWs", "Mary Sues" and "feminist agendas" rears its ugly head I have absolutely no interest any more.
Funnily enough I've never any of these terms in real life conversations; only on the internet! Even the only friend of mine that absolutely hated TLJ did not point to any of these as being reasons for not liking it.
'SJWs' or 'feminist agendas' aren't why I don't like The Last Jedi. The awful story and how it makes no sense as a direct follow up to The Force Awakens is why and throws out pretty much every interesting plot point from the previous film.
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Old 22-06-2018, 09:26   #590
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Yes, the fact that she has an instant perfect skillset for everything she does because plot. For instance, I watched Episode IV last night and Luke (and pretty much everyone) isn't a good shot with blasters. Every firefight is back a forth with missed shots and ducking into cover. Rey in The Force Awakens takes one shot with that small blaster that Han gives her and suddenly can take out two Stormtroopers with pinpoint accuracy. If the film showed he character actually developing throughout both films she'd be far more interesting.
I don't think this is an issue for me when watching TFA as I expected the reasons for her ability would be explained in TLJ. So I will accept that they missed a trick in TLJ by not fleshing out why she has her abilities. In a 2.5 hour film I think they could have fitted it in easily. However, despite that I am very happy that they dismissed her parentage entirely. Kylo being Han and Leia's son works fine for me but if Rey turned out to be his cousin or sister, my eyes would have rolled out of my head.

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'SJWs' or 'feminist agendas' aren't why I don't like The Last Jedi.
Although you and others have brought up these issues in this thread I didn't suggest that was your reason for not liking it and do completely understand your real reasons for not liking it despite not agreeing. However, I have no interest in talking to anyone who uses those terms seriously, especially when we are discussing a family sci-fi adventure movie.

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Old 22-06-2018, 22:17   #591
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On the trains, presumably it is efficiency. Flying is expensive, which is why we don't all fly everywhere now. But I see your point. It was probably deemed more efficient than riding round on giant lizards like they did in the prequels
They are transporting such a valuable on a barely guarded train? I just couldnt get past that because the writers just wanted a set piece. It would have been transported on a ship with fighter escort.

I am not a hardcore geek who gets upset about things. I just thought it was weak storytelling.
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Old 23-06-2018, 16:29   #592
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They are transporting such a valuable on a barely guarded train? I just couldnt get past that because the writers just wanted a set piece. It would have been transported on a ship with fighter escort.

I am not a hardcore geek who gets upset about things. I just thought it was weak storytelling.
We transport nukes and nuclear waste by unguarded truck and train in the UK
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Old 23-06-2018, 18:34   #593
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Wasn't the train carrying thousands of tonnes of that fuel on a very snowy, sub-zero planet? I seem to recall they only took one carriage that made up a small sub-section of the entire train so I assume the train is meant to be a mass transportation device on a planet where the weather could make flying sketchy at certain times of the year maybe? That's the only way I can make any sense of it tbh, and it's not the only dumb set piece in the film!

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Old 23-06-2018, 19:12   #594
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Why is this film being mocked for its silly set pieces? It's pretty much every action film
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Old 23-06-2018, 19:59   #595
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Pretty much any factory in any action film would have been shut down in real life due to health and safety violations.
Doesn't stop the film being exciting though.
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Old 24-06-2018, 17:32   #596
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Wasn't the train carrying thousands of tonnes of that fuel on a very snowy, sub-zero planet? I seem to recall they only took one carriage that made up a small sub-section of the entire train so I assume the train is meant to be a mass transportation device on a planet where the weather could make flying sketchy at certain times of the year maybe? That's the only way I can make any sense of it tbh, and it's not the only dumb set piece in the film!
Its a wonder the Empire has any money left, could they have not built a pipeline?
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Old 25-06-2018, 07:10   #597
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Its a wonder the Empire has any money left, could they have not built a pipeline?
The fuel might not have been liquid.
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Old 25-06-2018, 09:04   #598
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Nor was it massively stable
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Old 25-06-2018, 09:46   #599
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Pretty much any factory in any action film would have been shut down in real life due to health and safety violations.
Doesn't stop the film being exciting though.
Always wondered how the Death Star got passed health and safety. All those high walkways with no railings.
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Old 25-06-2018, 17:37   #600
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Always wondered how the Death Star got passed health and safety. All those high walkways with no railings.
Jedi mind trick on the Council inspector.
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