Go Back   Forums @ The Digital Fix > Entertainment Discussion Forums > Sports Forum

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 17-08-2011, 14:35   #201
pompeyfan
Built for comfort
 
pompeyfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Isle of Wight
Posts: 8,294
Thanks: 118
Thanked 41 Times in 20 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxNutter View Post
such as Peter Storrie?

i don't see how the spending of self-sufficient clubs, living within their means, can be said to be ruining the game...

at least City look like they'll have something to fall back on, should things start to go pear-shaped.
...and how did these self-sufficent clubs get that way? well in the case of the elite it's by rigging competitions and getting rules changed to suit themselves and increase their revenue to the detriment of others eg. reducing the top flight to 20 clubs to help the clubs in europe, same with removing replays from the FA and League Cups, giving byes to clubs in Europe and removing 2 legged ties so that they can play more European matches, fixing the CL so they can't be knocked out of Europe before Christmas and get a guaranteed 6 matches (normally more as the seeding helps them as well), devalued the UEFA Cup by insisting failed CL sides get a 2nd stab at Europe, Premier league breaking away from the football league and cutting their income from TV money, changing the rules on tickets so that home clubs get 100% instead of a 50/50 split - all these things have helped the 'big clubs' lucky enough to be big at the time become self-sufficent but at the cost of the rest of the clubs in England losing revenue streams (IIRC it was Man U, Liverpool and Arsenal throwing their toys out the pram unless things changed by threatening to bugger off to a European Superleague), what Man City are doing will in no way have the detrimental effect on football that the 'big clubs' already have, and it seems to be only fans of the big few and the big clubs themselves that have a problem with it because all of a sudden their little cartel has been broken - wonder how long it'll be before a campaign starts for 5 CL sides so the big 4 don't risk missing out on the cash starts?
__________________
"Give a poor man a gun and he can rob a bank.
Give a poor man a bank and he can rob everyone."

Last edited by pompeyfan; 17-08-2011 at 14:38.
pompeyfan is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 14:35   #202
Guest 12934
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 7,253
Thanks: 35
Thanked 6 Times in 3 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grunge View Post
while your busy in hysterics, Ask yourself this, Hypothetically, If the British royal family owned a football team, and British airways sponsored it. would there be a problem?
Can you genuinely not see any difference between the ornamental status of the British royal family in the UK and the Abu Dhabi royal family, who effectively own the country (ok, emirate), its oil and its airline??
Guest 12934 is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 14:44   #203
Citysmith
Feed the Goat..
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Manchester, England
Posts: 4,434
Thanks: 61
Thanked 45 Times in 11 Posts
Pompey fan that is the best post I've read for ages in the words of Andy Gray ' Take a bow son'
__________________
Oh, Man City, the only football team to come from Manchester
Citysmith is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 14:45   #204
Grunge
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Warrington
Posts: 2,959
Thanks: 45
Thanked 27 Times in 24 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseflesh View Post
Can you genuinely not see any difference between the ornamental status of the British royal family in the UK and the Abu Dhabi royal family, who effectively own the country (ok, emirate), its oil and its airline??
yeah there is a difference, it was the best hypothetical question I could think of.
Grunge is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 14:48   #205
MaxNutter
20
 
MaxNutter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Timperley
Posts: 16,593
Thanks: 313
Thanked 989 Times in 578 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyfan View Post
...and how did these self-sufficent clubs get that way? well in the case of the elite it's by rigging competitions and getting rules changed to suit themselves and increase their revenue to the detriment of others eg. reducing the top flight to 20 clubs to help the clubs in europe, same with removing replays from the FA and League Cups, giving byes to clubs in Europe and removing 2 legged ties so that they can play more European matches, fixing the CL so they can't be knocked out of Europe before Christmas and get a guaranteed 6 matches (normally more as the seeding helps them as well), devalued the UEFA Cup by insisting failed CL sides get a 2nd stab at Europe, Premier league breaking away from the football league and cutting their income from TV money, changing the rules on tickets so that home clubs get 100% instead of a 50/50 split - all these things have helped the 'big clubs' lucky enough to be big at the time become self-sufficent but at the cost of the rest of the clubs in England losing revenue streams (IIRC it was Man U, Liverpool and Arsenal throwing their toys out the pram unless things changed by threatening to bugger off to a European Superleague), what Man City are doing will in no way have the detrimental effect on football that the 'big clubs' already have, and it seems to be only fans of the big few and the big clubs themselves that have a problem with it because all of a sudden their little cartel has been broken - wonder how long it'll be before a campaign starts for 5 CL sides so the big 4 don't risk missing out on the cash starts?
i think many of those 'big clubs' were probably already self-sufficient (United have been for many years), if anything, those changes were supposed to allow us (English clubs) to compete in Europe too.

when the PL was being discussed, City were performing well, finishing above United in 1991, and apparently have a bigger local fan-base, so unlike other teams, their 'wilderness years' can't be attributed to reckless spending, but rather the bizarre hiring and firing policy of a loony former chairman...
__________________
"He has his mother's eyes..."
"I thought we had them?"
MaxNutter is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 14:50   #206
MaxNutter
20
 
MaxNutter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Timperley
Posts: 16,593
Thanks: 313
Thanked 989 Times in 578 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Citysmith View Post
Pompey fan that is the best post I've read for ages in the words of Andy Gray ' Take a bow son'
ah, but he'll always be remembered for 'Charlotte, can you tuck this down here for me?'
__________________
"He has his mother's eyes..."
"I thought we had them?"
MaxNutter is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 15:10   #207
Guest 12934
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 7,253
Thanks: 35
Thanked 6 Times in 3 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grunge View Post
yeah there is a difference, it was the best hypothetical question I could think of.
A better analogy would be if the Chinese government bought a mid-table PL team (lets face it, there aren't many governments in the world who'd be in a position to do it), and there was suddenly a £400m sponsorship deal on the table from Air China.
Would that stink too? Yes, to high heaven.
Guest 12934 is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 15:11   #208
nutter45
burninator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: London
Posts: 10,742
Thanks: 1,461
Thanked 652 Times in 423 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grunge View Post
while your busy in hysterics, Ask yourself this, Hypothetically, If the British royal family owned a football team, and British airways sponsored it. would there be a problem?
Sorry but that is a hopeless analogy.
nutter45 is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 15:27   #209
baffled
XBL GT: Sismastery
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: London
Posts: 3,085
Thanks: 71
Thanked 130 Times in 83 Posts
Great post pompeyfan.
__________________
Canon 400d EF-S 17-55mm | EF 50mm f/1.8 | EF 85mm f/1.8 | Tamron 90mm f/2.8 Macro DI | Sigma 30mm f/1.4
Lowepro Slingshot 100 AW + Rezo 160 AW
My Flickr Page
baffled is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 15:57   #210
Grunge
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Warrington
Posts: 2,959
Thanks: 45
Thanked 27 Times in 24 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseflesh View Post
A better analogy would be if the Chinese government bought a mid-table PL team (lets face it, there aren't many governments in the world who'd be in a position to do it), and there was suddenly a £400m sponsorship deal on the table from Air China.
Would that stink too? Yes, to high heaven.
Removing the stigma of the Chinese name, if it happened, and they jumped through hoops like we have to ensure it fits within UEFA FFPR guidelines I honestly wouldn't have a problem with it.

The City Brand has increased massively since the take over, and over the next 10 years will continue to increase massively, and Etihad are getting a very large world wide coverage from the sponsorship deal, therefore it's doing exactly what they wanted it to do.

Etihad, formed in 2003 and are the worlds fastest growing Airline and want that growth to continue £40m a year to sponsor a massively up and coming football team 210 acre site in a major city in Europe is getting them a lot of press, hopefully allowing there expansion to all that to happen.

When you look at the other sponsorship they have out there it's not like it's totally un expected they would want to continue.

*Ferrari F1
*Harlequins Rugby team ( including a stand name change )
*Etihad Arena in Melbourne

There are more but I cant be bothered listing them all. So while it is a large deal, its not uncommon for them to sponsor things, and this is a very very large thing to sponsor.

Last edited by Grunge; 17-08-2011 at 15:59.
Grunge is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:02   #211
MaxNutter
20
 
MaxNutter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Timperley
Posts: 16,593
Thanks: 313
Thanked 989 Times in 578 Posts
are they fastest growing through bums on seats, or just because they have the biggest investors?
__________________
"He has his mother's eyes..."
"I thought we had them?"
MaxNutter is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:14   #212
Grunge
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Warrington
Posts: 2,959
Thanks: 45
Thanked 27 Times in 24 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxNutter View Post
are they fastest growing through bums on seats, or just because they have the biggest investors?
A mix of both by the look of it. seems to have a lot of bank loans and investment outside Adu Dhabi though.

from Wiki,

started in 2003 with 1 destinations, in 2004 bought 5 Boeing 777's and 24 airbus aircraft ( $8bn USD ). In 2008 did the largest order of commercial aircraft in history for up to 205 planes.

in 2007 they had 4m passenges a year, in 2010 that was up to 7m. It now fly's 70 destinations

Not from wiki but from other news: Etihad planning to increase to 100 destinations by 2017.

Last edited by Grunge; 17-08-2011 at 16:18.
Grunge is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:18   #213
DeadYankee
.
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Orkney
Posts: 34,308
Thanks: 1,320
Thanked 2,049 Times in 1,080 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Citysmith View Post
Pompey fan that is the best post I've read for ages in the words of Andy Gray ' Take a bow son'
Unfortunately it's utter cobblers, but then that's only to be expected given how Portsmouth tried and failed to buy their way to success with unearned money
DeadYankee is online now  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:21   #214
Grunge
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Warrington
Posts: 2,959
Thanks: 45
Thanked 27 Times in 24 Posts
I wonder what will happen when the Disney sponsorship gets announced as that's likely to be another massive amount of cash. At least Disney cant be accused of being part of the Abu Dhabi group.
Grunge is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:23   #215
Citysmith
Feed the Goat..
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Manchester, England
Posts: 4,434
Thanks: 61
Thanked 45 Times in 11 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadYankee View Post
Unfortunately it's utter cobblers, but then that's only to be expected given how Portsmouth tried and failed to buy their way to success with unearned money
Interesting that you feel that way DY

What do you feel he was right with and more importantly what do you think he was wrong about. I thought he hit the nail on the head with most.
__________________
Oh, Man City, the only football team to come from Manchester
Citysmith is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:29   #216
DeadYankee
.
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Orkney
Posts: 34,308
Thanks: 1,320
Thanked 2,049 Times in 1,080 Posts
I thought it was all complete and utter toss which just seeks to deflect from the ghastly attampt to buy success happening in Manchester. All other clubs, bar Chelsea, have reached their status based upon merit. As far as I am concerned both clubs should be expelled from all competitions. Hope that helps.

Last edited by DeadYankee; 17-08-2011 at 16:29.
DeadYankee is online now  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:29   #217
Grunge
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Warrington
Posts: 2,959
Thanks: 45
Thanked 27 Times in 24 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Citysmith View Post
Interesting that you feel that way DY
Because in acknowledged it as correct he would be inadvertently admitting City funding is ok.
Grunge is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:31   #218
Grunge
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Warrington
Posts: 2,959
Thanks: 45
Thanked 27 Times in 24 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadYankee View Post
I thought it was all complete and utter toss which just seeks to deflect from the ghastly attampt to buy success happening in Manchester. All other clubs, bar Chelsea, have reached their status based upon merit. As far as I am concerned both clubs should be expelled from all competitions. Hope that helps.
So you honestly don't believe that "top clubs" manipulate the system to increase there profits and maintain success?
Grunge is offline  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:33   #219
DeadYankee
.
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Orkney
Posts: 34,308
Thanks: 1,320
Thanked 2,049 Times in 1,080 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grunge View Post
Because in acknowledged it as correct he would be inadvertently admitting City funding is ok.
Well, no it wouldn't as there is no comparison whatsoever, however much you would like there to be. Your club is a joke, a rich man's play thing. Every single one of you that buys into it has sold their soul for fools gold. Hollow, meaningless success.
DeadYankee is online now  
Old 17-08-2011, 16:34   #220
DeadYankee
.
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Orkney
Posts: 34,308
Thanks: 1,320
Thanked 2,049 Times in 1,080 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grunge View Post
So you honestly don't believe that "top clubs" manipulate the system to increase there profits and maintain success?
I'm not sure I understand what top clubs and Manchester City have in common but all other clubs, bar Chelsea, have developed their profile and income based upon success on the pitch and through good business. Not through whoring themselves to foreign oligarchs.
DeadYankee is online now  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The (ongoing) Official league two thread 2012-2013 sleep4ever Sports Forum 301 21-05-2013 06:37
The Manchester United Thread 2010/2011 Thread Alan b Sports Forum 1013 14-08-2011 17:28
The Manchester City 2010-2011 Thread Alan b Sports Forum 998 28-07-2011 15:26
The Manchester United Thread 2010/2011 Alan b Sports Forum 1002 14-05-2011 17:16
The Manchester United Thread 2010/2011 Alan b Sports Forum 1010 20-04-2011 15:38

All times are GMT. The time now is 21:42.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.qq
Copyright ©2000 - 2021 Network N Ltd.