Go Back   Forums @ The Digital Fix > Entertainment Discussion Forums > DVD and Blu-ray Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 18-08-2006, 10:32   #1
djjr
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 42
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
The future of classic films on HD?

With the current hype surrounding high definition content on HD-DVD and Blueray, I've been wondering what this means for the future of classic films. Obviously films like The Wizard of Oz which have been recently remastered in 4k are ripe for release in such formats (and I'm very interested to see what it will be like in HD). However it seems somewhat unlikely that a film like Rififi, as great as it is, will ever get such treatment.

So what does everyone think? Are you looking forward to seeing some classic films in HD? Is it likely any more than a handfull will ever be released? Will the volume of classic DVD releases slow down as they concentrate on releasing 'blockbusters' in HD for the mass-market? I'd be interested to hear your opinions...
djjr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 10:47   #2
R-T-C
Klaus Kinksi's pet dog
 
R-T-C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Keighley, UK
Posts: 2,982
Thanks: 35
Thanked 17 Times in 15 Posts
Well, that all depends how well HD takes off.

If it ultimately comes to replace DVD, in the same way that DVD replaced VHS, then we will see classic films come out I'm sure. Afterall the first films out on DVD were just blockbusters, and it has taken 8 or 9 years to get some classics onto DVD, but eventually they will all emerge.

If, instead, HD-DVD is a luxury like DVDA or laserdiscs, then you'll get some classic films (probably those with HD transfers available) but not many. Meanwhile, these films will continue to get SD-DVD releases keeping us happy!
__________________
Mondo Esoterica - cult and obscure film and DVD reviews | Flickr Gallery - British motorsports photography and more.
R-T-C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 11:04   #3
drush9999
Trusted User
 
drush9999's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: England - The Land of Do-As-You-Please?
Posts: 2,196
Thanks: 48
Thanked 36 Times in 31 Posts
I think they will release classic films, most dvds are derived from High Definition transfers these days. So it would be very cost effective.

Problem is whether the HD formats are seen as being for home theater people or film buffs in general. Laserdisc was a magic combination of both, which is why there is varied selection of classic films on that format.
drush9999 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 15:51   #4
Guest 53019
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,216
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
It seems to me that HD, even though it's relatively fresh off the boat, is a resounding dud. No one cares except the technogeeks who have to have the latest and greatest. As I've said elsewhere, I think both formats are doomed because it's too soon to ask the public to switch - not when the average consumer has just embraced DVD over the last few years. It can't happen, just like DAT couldn't happen three or four years after CDs. Or the Mini-Disc player. Too soon.

I've been reading reviews of the three or four catalog titles (Blazing Saddles, Full Metal Jacket, etc) and what I'm reading is just what you'd think - no raves for the transfers. Both BS and FMJ are reported as looking soft (and both "reviewers" blame the original photography!!!), so what exactly are we gaining here? Softer clarity? I'm interested to hear reports on The Searchers, of course - if it's been tweaked (doubtful, but we'll see - I have my own theories about what we're going to hear), color-wise, I may just have to invest in a machine. But unless there's a dramatic difference, I just don't see the point, really, as I'm not a fan of current motion picture making, and those titles are the only ones thus far that are getting good comments.

Last edited by haineshisway; 18-08-2006 at 15:52.
Guest 53019 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 16:03   #5
Guest 53667
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 129
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Aside from a few high profile titles (such as Oz, Gone with the Wind, Lawrence of Arabia, etc.), I don't think many classic films will be released in HD until the format wars are settled.
It's taken almost a decade to get a lot of classic titles onto standard DVD--and I doubt many of those will ever make it to HD.
Guest 53667 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 17:44   #6
jroadley
Trusted User
 
jroadley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Aylsham, Norfolk
Posts: 5,399
Thanks: 85
Thanked 133 Times in 69 Posts
Are there many HD masters of classic films? With SKY currently only having 2 HD Movie Channels, I'd love to see a SKY Cinema HD
__________________
Jonathan Roadley
jroadley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 17:53   #7
Guest 16217
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 195
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 2 Posts
Well Spartacus is coming soon to hd-dvd so there are classics on the way.

I've seen a few classic movies in high def and they were all good. These are some of the classics that are shown on the american high def channels. So there must be a market for them:

King of Kings
My Fair Lady
A Shot in the Dark
Court Jester
Jason and the argonauts
The Apartment
Wicker Man
Ben Hur
Good bad and Ugly
Magnificent Seven
Some like it hot
Irma la douce
Bonnie and Clyde
From Russia with love
Anatomy of a Murder
Odd Couple
2001 Space Oddesey
Time Machine (1960)
Towering Inferno
Wizard of Oz
Gone with the wind


I expect when Image (who control criterion) decides to release their collection on high def - we'll end up seing much of their collection in high def (so long as criterion still has the rights). But I expect criterion will wait for a larger userbase before releasing its collection - although interestingly Image has just announced a few titles for hddvd..just not criterion yet
Guest 16217 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 18:11   #8
Spectre07
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: None Bothered
Posts: 5,806
Thanks: 6
Thanked 18 Times in 7 Posts
I agree with haineshisway. I think HD DVD is going to be a minority pursuit and not a replacement to DVD. I'm not salivating at the prospect of seeing a lot of classic films in a higher definition transfer.
Spectre07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2006, 20:04   #9
Guest 4576
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: London, UK
Posts: 2,572
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I'm forced to agree with haineshisway too - even the list am1001aa gives are all pretty much canonical favourites. The problem is, you may have The Magnificent Seven and Some Like It Hot, but what about Libeled Lady? The Queen of Spades? Comanche Station?

I'm convinced high-definition presentations for the great majority of classic films will highlight as many flaws in the original elements as it brings detail, and it simply won't be economically feasible to restore the likes of those listed above to the stage where they would be considered "acceptable" to the majority of high-end techno-freaks.
Guest 4576 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 07:05   #10
douglasb
Suedehead.
 
douglasb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Exiled in England
Posts: 11,166
Thanks: 149
Thanked 933 Times in 557 Posts
You'd be surprised at what DOES exist in HD transfer. Here's a quote from the boss at the Monsters HD channel:

===

Does Monsters HD have theme nights, where you’ll have all vampires, all werewolves, or what have you?

Yes. We actually have a festival in October called Vampire Batty. It’s shows everything from Italian horror flicks like Slaughter of the Vampire to Scars of Dracula with Christopher Lee, and the Subspecies trilogy. We also have something called Zombie-Thon, where we show everything from Dead Alive (Peter Jackson’s early film) to Night of the Living Dead, Last Man on Earth, Dawn of the Dead, and so on. So yes, we do package our movies up. We have an H.P. Lovecraft Fright Festival with everything from Reanimator and Bride of Reanimator, to The Unnamable, The Resurrected, Die Monster Die. So we do marathons and theme nights, and I think it’s an effective way to communicate to the viewer, what we have. MONSTERS HD has quite a variety of creature features and monster movies. We like to consider our movies as having everything and anything to do with a monster – and that includes human monsters, whether they be the serial killer in slasher films, from the Nightmare on Elm Streets, the Friday the 13ths, to Hannibal Lechter in Silence of The Lambs to the Texas Chainsaw Massacres. We also have our prehistoric monster movies – the Godzilla movies, in particular. We also have the Gamera movies. Then we have our alien monsters as in creatures from outer space. Plus supernatural creatures, whether they be demonic like the ones from Night of the Demons to The Amityville horror series, and The Exorcist. We program our movies under those categories – that’s what makes them monster movies.

Last edited by douglasb; 19-08-2006 at 07:09.
douglasb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 07:36   #11
Guest 11357
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 51
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by am1001aa
I expect when Image (who control criterion)
Just a slight correction here. Image do not control Criterion. They only distribute Criterion's products.
Guest 11357 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 13:41   #12
Guest 28750
What the BBFC Ban, I Buy
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: What was the U.K
Posts: 2,335
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Surely this should be in the HD forum?
Guest 28750 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 13:42   #13
Spectre07
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: None Bothered
Posts: 5,806
Thanks: 6
Thanked 18 Times in 7 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by douglasb
You'd be surprised at what DOES exist in HD transfer..
I've made this point over in the HD forums but I don't think some older movies are going to benefit from a HD transfer. Godzilla is obviously a man in a suit and how much more obvious is that fact going to appear when you watch the films in crystal clear high definition? Low budget horror films, I think, will simply look awful how good are cardboard sets, cheap masks etc going to look in HD?
Spectre07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 13:53   #14
John Hodson
Out to lunch...
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Bolton, Lancashire
Posts: 12,507
Thanks: 9
Thanked 55 Times in 4 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilbones
Surely this should be in the HD forum?
Where it would probably wither and die. I, for one, think this is the proper area to debate classic movies whatever the format.

Both Sony and Granada Ventures (to name but two) have been busy making HD transfers of their classic back catalogue for a couple of years (at least). Personally, I'm quite happy with my current SD set-up, I simply can't see how much better films can look, played through my current player, seen on my current LCD screen. But then again, I'm not projecting onto a, say, six foot plus wide, screen, where what I would consider an acceptable transfer might look a little iffy.

I'm not buying into HD for those reasons (and others have made very good points; particularly that HD would, possibly, only accentuate the negative in certain restorations) and the fact that I'm not about to replace the majority of my library of classics, whether it be HD or SD. I'm happy with what I have; and I just know that, had I a HD player, I would be sorely tempted into that double, triple (or even quadruple) dip. Not playing.

Well, not yet...
__________________
So many films, so little time...
My Film Journal Blog
Emily Collingwood: I can't see him. All I can see is the flags...

Last edited by John Hodson; 19-08-2006 at 14:28.
John Hodson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 14:20   #15
Guest 16217
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 195
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 2 Posts
Here are few high def screenshots - they are at 1920x1080 resolution

Anatomy of a murder - screenshot 1



Anatomy of a murder - screenshot 2



The Apartment - screenshot 1



The Apartment - screenshot 2



Ben Hur - screenshot 1



Ben Hur - screenshot 2



Ben Hur - screenshot 3



Ben Hur - screenshot 4




If you want some more - let me know

Last edited by am1001aa; 19-08-2006 at 14:45.
Guest 16217 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 15:17   #16
AndyWilson
--------old-geek
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 11,988
Thanks: 124
Thanked 420 Times in 195 Posts
I've argued in the HD forum, and I think it's worth repeating here, that HD screen grabs bear no relation to the experience of watching a film where most of us don't peer closely at the screen to see how much detail they can see.

Personally I can't see how HD would improve my enjoyment of, say, Brighton Rock or Some Like It Hot. In fact I worry that if studios ever start to concentrate on HD releases classics, even on normal DVD, may be low on their priorities. Just look at the SkyHD threads to see how people are choosing what to watch based by how good it looks rather than the content. If they base their DVD buying decisions on the same criteria it's not good news for any "minority interest" releases.
AndyWilson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 15:41   #17
Guest 16217
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 195
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 2 Posts
A few more:

Gone with the Wind - screenshot1



Gone with the Wind - screenshot2



Gone with the wind - screenshot3



Gone with the Wind - screenshot4


Last edited by am1001aa; 19-08-2006 at 15:43.
Guest 16217 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 15:56   #18
Guest 16217
Trusted User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 195
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 2 Posts
Personally I cannot wait for HDDVD and Bluray. I'm waiting for the conference which is happening in early sept where the european hd-dvd announcement is due to be made.

Based on that, I'll either buy a european hd-dvd player, or import one from the states (I've already pre-ordered my PS3 which will be my starter bluray player).

Note that the screengrabs above were taken from mpeg2 sources (often lowish bitrates), and I'm expecting both formats to have better quality than the screengrabs (particularily vc1 based transfers to show the most picture detail).

While I do agree with some aspects of the posts above, overall my own personal experience is different. When I have watched a much-loved film in high def after watching it for a lifetime in standard def, I find that the better colour, the better detail, the more depth to the image has often been a revelation to me. My set up is reasonable but not high end - I use a pc running winddvd, outputting to my Sony HS50 LCD front projector which is native 1280 x 720, and I watch on a 100" screen.

Last edited by am1001aa; 20-08-2006 at 09:02.
Guest 16217 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 16:16   #19
earl_roberts2002
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,677
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
I've got to join the 'not fussed' brigade. A switch in format is much too early for me and I just don't see any real benefit for doing so. To state the obvious, DVD was a revelation due to the obvious clarity it offered, surround sound, special features and the fact that you no longer had to rewind and fast-forward tapes!! The only benefit HD offers is a better [or should that simply be 'sharper'?] picture when the 'deficits' of DVD are yet to be revealed to me on my 28 inch set. The only advantage would be a continued falling in DVD's already low prices, however I could see major studios simply stopping DVD production if it were to be successful.
earl_roberts2002 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-08-2006, 16:22   #20
earl_roberts2002
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,677
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
I also don't thing there would be a chance in hell for 'obscurities' [Cassavetes for example who isn't exactly widely represented on DVD] having HD releases for a looong time! If the major studios released their major films on HD whilst labels such as Criterion, MoC, etc. continued to release classics on DVD it would be ideal for those such as ourselves for example but I couldn't see it happening for long.
earl_roberts2002 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
blu ray, Blu-ray Disc, classic films, hd-dvd, High Definition

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

All times are GMT. The time now is 02:56.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.qq
Copyright ©2000 - 2021 Network N Ltd.