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Old 08-01-2008, 21:56   #21
ben.bayliss
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Holy thread revival, Batman!!

So this is back on this week, specialising in 'young' animals. Last night was suckling pig, and tonight Billy Goats!

Despite the 'live' claims it was clearly pre-recorded, but I thought the whole concept of the show is excellent. The problem is the people who will choose to watch this aren't the people who need to be educated most.

They should show this sort of thing in schools imo. If we're to eat meat and treat it as a commodity, we should be forced to understand what goes into the process getting it to our plates.
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Old 08-01-2008, 22:41   #22
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It both annoyed me and pleased me to see this return to BBC3 last night. On one hand it's important for people to actually see where their meat comes from and how it's produced BUT this program has been done before so why now bring it back and focus on young animals??

The cynic in me feels that the original series was commissioned mainly for 'shock value' but ended up back-firing on the program makers.
It actually managed to get the message across that if one is to eat meat then at some point animals must be killed and that this can be done humanely, cleanly and with as little stress inflicted on the animals as possible.

Not to be kept down it feels now that the program makers have decided to seek greater public impact with this new series choosing this time to focus on younger animals that pull on the heart-strings a little more. Maybe I'm wrong.

With my cynic mode off I totally agree with you, ben.bayliss that the concept and the information provided by this show is excellent and should be watched by a lot MORE people than will actually end up watching it.
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Old 08-01-2008, 22:47   #23
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Its plainly shock tv, disguised as 'educational'. Who thinks up these progs, the veggie tv mob?

Well all know that animals are killed, butchered, cooked and eaten, even if you dont work in that field why should it really amaze you?
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Old 08-01-2008, 22:48   #24
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I feel the same, killing a baby or adult pig is exacltly the same process so why the need to show it with young animals.

I found the first series intresting, caught 10 mins of it last night but dont really see the point
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Old 09-01-2008, 01:34   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tizza View Post
Its plainly shock tv, disguised as 'educational'. Who thinks up these progs, the veggie tv mob?

Well all know that animals are killed, butchered, cooked and eaten, even if you dont work in that field why should it really amaze you?
I genuinely don't think that enough of us really do 'know' this. I've certainly heard of people not knowing that pork is pig, that lamb is baby sheep etc..(because of the different words we use when it becomes a meat)
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Old 09-01-2008, 10:17   #26
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I liked the last series and watched every one and found it interesting. Started watching the piglet the other night and actually fell asleep before anything had happened.
The 30 mins programmes were short but to the point but they now seem to be an hour.

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Old 09-01-2008, 12:50   #27
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Felt sorry for the poor piggies on Monday night. Last night was quite hard to watch too - one of the slaugherhouse peeps stunned a kid, but there was a fair bit of blood coming out of his head. How does the stunning work?
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Old 09-01-2008, 22:50   #28
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Felt sorry for the poor piggies on Monday night. Last night was quite hard to watch too - one of the slaugherhouse peeps stunned a kid, but there was a fair bit of blood coming out of his head. How does the stunning work?
Why would stunning the animal stop blood coming out it's head

The stunning process is basically just knocking the animal out quickly, so it doesn't feel anything when it's cut open to quickly bleed to death.

Quite interesting to see that we have this on BBC3, and the whole series of programmes going on over at C4 (starting with the Hugh F-W Chicken Run stuff). This though is more 'sensationalist' though.
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Old 09-01-2008, 23:37   #29
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thought the bit in tonight's show where the bloke was point-blank shooting the unwanted calves was pretty sad.

It put a completely different viewpoint on the "veal is cruel" belief that most people have. In a way, by NOT eating veal we're condemning the calves. Vegetarians should do their bit and start eating veal too!

I thought the farmer and the gun-wielding slaughterman were pretty brave appearing on camera! Just the sort of people that get their lives interfered with by misguided animal rights nutjobs.
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Old 10-01-2008, 12:32   #30
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Why would stunning the animal stop blood coming out it's head

The stunning process is basically just knocking the animal out quickly, so it doesn't feel anything when it's cut open to quickly bleed to death.
In the last series, they seemed to stun most of the animals with a pair of electric tongs, was just wondering why the change in method...?
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Old 10-01-2008, 20:19   #31
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Good programme in terms of educating people as to what goes on in as far as it went (the veal one). Bad in the fact that they made it all too nice and as acceptable as possible - a super sanitised and clean abbatoir/studio, very few cattle on site or coming through, care and attention paid by all staff in new uniform and full protective gear, vets everywhere etc. The presenter and vet were quick to spout the accepted lines that the stunning works, that the convulsing is purely reflex, that there's no pain and an instant death and so on. In reality I don't believe any of that's true and the conditions are way worse than those simulated when they have to work at speed and under pressure with many animals without any regard for their welfare. Too glossy and "nice" for me. Still shocking though - however much of a spin they put on it. If that can put people off 1 dish I'm sure there are plenty of videos out there of real animal abuse on farms that could change them forever.

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Old 10-01-2008, 20:30   #32
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Yes i agree, the large slaughter houses that provide Tesco for example slaughter hundreds of cattle a day, its a fast paced productions line.
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Old 10-01-2008, 20:49   #33
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Yes i agree, the large slaughter houses that provide Tesco for example slaughter hundreds of cattle a day, its a fast paced productions line.
Exactly - it's nothing more than a production line from start to finish. As long as no one gets sick they don't care - even that's becoming less and less important as the infected cattle are killed off, you get compensated and you start again. I still don't get why the increase in livestock born diseases spreading to the human population hasn't put people off this mass produced rubbish never mind the welfare considerations - something the programme didn't really touch on - as it all looked so lovely I guess.

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Old 10-01-2008, 22:27   #34
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Originally Posted by steford View Post
Good programme in terms of educating people as to what goes on in as far as it went (the veal one). Bad in the fact that they made it all too nice and as acceptable as possible - a super sanitised and clean abbatoir/studio, very few cattle on site or coming through, care and attention paid by all staff in new uniform and full protective gear, vets everywhere etc. The presenter and vet were quick to spout the accepted lines that the stunning works, that the convulsing is purely reflex, that there's no pain and an instant death and so on. In reality I don't believe any of that's true and the conditions are way worse than those simulated when they have to work at speed and under pressure with many animals without any regard for their welfare. Too glossy and "nice" for me. Still shocking though - however much of a spin they put on it. If that can put people off 1 dish I'm sure there are plenty of videos out there of real animal abuse on farms that could change them forever.
I need to watch it again to be sure but I have to say that the first two cows they did last night did the twitching thing, fair enough, but the third one definitely seemed to be having a good old struggle all the time from when they "stunned" it, as it was going up the hoist thing, and right through the bloke cutting it's throat. You saw the slaughterman put his booted foot on it to hold it still enough to get the chain round it's legs for the hoist. The others after being stunned just sort of collapsed on the floor.

Also the more I've thought about it the less I think I will eat reconstituted meat products, I mean I've known I shouldn't for a long time but maybe this is the switch I need to actually stop. The wimpy malnourished calves that they said went for pies and stuff (meat reclamation) - the ones that didn't get trucked to Europe or shot in the barn and burnt - looked so bad.

Baaa baaa cute little lambs tonight! I think they should have done a bambi one and a duck one as they are both pretty cute animals.
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Old 11-01-2008, 01:58   #35
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Ugh the baby lambs one was the grimmest of the lot I think. That first poor lamb was clearly not happy about having been half-electrocuted so tried to run away, and was still wriggling about like a good'un even after having the bolt through the head
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Old 11-01-2008, 15:30   #36
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I'm pretty much on the fence about this i.e. uneasy about the thought of slaughterhouses but not enough to stop eating meat.

The only thing I'd say to people who object to these practices is are they any worse than when you see a nature documentary where say a zebra or deer undergoes a terrifying chase and is eventually is dragged down and pulled to pieces by a pride of lions?

Nature can be pretty cruel too.
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Old 11-01-2008, 15:34   #37
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Ugh the baby lambs one was the grimmest of the lot I think. That first poor lamb was clearly not happy about having been half-electrocuted so tried to run away, and was still wriggling about like a good'un even after having the bolt through the head

Little bugger didnt want to go down did he
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Old 11-01-2008, 17:52   #38
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Just watching the lambs now and with all the 'controversy' surrounding the issue they really didn't need the stunning to fail with the first lamb in such a public manner. Not very nice... Notice they didn't even try the electric tongs after that.
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Old 11-01-2008, 19:08   #39
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In reality I don't believe any of that's true and the conditions are way worse than those simulated when they have to work at speed and under pressure with many animals without any regard for their welfare. Too glossy and "nice" for me.
I didn't watch this programme, but I do work in an abattoir (nothing to do with slaughtering, no thank you!) and animal welfare is paramount. That is the purpose of the vet you saw. The vets are not employed by abattoirs, but are placed in all licenced premises by the government, along with Meat Hygiene Service meat inspectors who would simply not allow killing to take place if the strict guidelines regarding animal welfare were not adhered to, and no killing can take place legally without them on the premises.
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Old 12-01-2008, 00:00   #40
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Watched this tonight. I think our standards employed in this country are by far the best. The spanish way was just wrong IMO, like the equivalent (sp?) to battery farmed chicken, they are battery farming pigs!
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