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Old 26-09-2008, 18:01   #121
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Elzar, on those photos you've taken of your monitor, is your monitor doing any overscanning, or are we seeing the complete 1920 x 1080 image in these photos?

I've had a quick look at the DVD version to compare, and yes indeed the HD versions are missing stuff on the top and bottom, and in some cases the HD versions has a bit more on the sides. I could make a side-by-side comparison, but the only fair way to do this would be to make sure that both the HDTV captures and DVD captures are the complete image (no overscan on either)

Marc

Last edited by marcmartin; 26-09-2008 at 18:07.
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Old 26-09-2008, 18:22   #122
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No overscanning, no. Like I said, it does feel crammed at times.
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Old 27-09-2008, 02:46   #123
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Comparison - DVD vs. Blu-Ray

Okay, here is a DVD vs. Blu-Ray comparison:










Last edited by marcmartin; 27-09-2008 at 02:49.
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Old 27-09-2008, 15:09   #124
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Good stuff. I think if anything we may encourage a few more sales...
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Old 27-09-2008, 20:59   #125
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Well, at least they haven't just lopped off the top and bottom with no regard as to what's there. The height of the cropped frame (in relation to the original) does appear to vary from shot to shot, which would indicate that someone's paying attention.
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Old 27-09-2008, 21:00   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elzar View Post
Good stuff. I think if anything we may encourage a few more sales...
With those screenshots?

The colour may be nicer and brighter but the comparison shows the cropping is dreadful.

Not sure how many die hard fans will pay for this rubbish above £40
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Old 27-09-2008, 21:01   #127
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Well, at least they haven't just lopped off the top and bottom with no regard as to what's there. The height of the cropped frame (in relation to the original) does appear to vary from shot to shot, which would indicate that someone's paying attention.
....just not very well!!
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Old 27-09-2008, 21:10   #128
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No, well, that was his point.
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Old 27-09-2008, 21:15   #129
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No, well, that was his point.
His point was that he believed whoever was in charge of the HD copy was making sure the frame was optimised for each shot - a positive thing.

My point was that actually they were making a bad job of it as shown by the screenshots.

And the shots on the whole look worse than I thought they would compared to the dvd based on the comments made that the dvd's were cropped on all 4 sides.

Since they look much better than the Bluray images (apart from the colour) the dvd's come out quite well.

Its a shame we cant actually see the full improvement in resolution too

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Old 27-09-2008, 22:38   #130
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Re: the framing, it looks if they've tried to keep a common topline at just above the highest (or only) head in the frame, where applicable. The last two shots are more severe regarding headroom, because the characters are using things in the lower portion of the frame that would almost be cropped out completely if the common topline was used (e.g. Tracey's communicator and Parker's steering wheel). Seems quite sensible to me.

Please note that I'm not condoning retrofitting like this, just pointing out that it's not as bad as it could've been. It's a pity that these aren't out in separate volumes, as one or two discs would be great for a rental just to see what's what.

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Old 27-09-2008, 23:11   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Niceguygeoff View Post
Re: the framing, it looks if they've tried to keep a common topline at just above the highest (or only) head in the frame, where applicable. The last two shots are more severe regarding headroom, because the characters are using things in the lower portion of the frame that would almost be cropped out completely if the common topline was used (e.g. Tracey's communicator and Parker's steering wheel). Seems quite sensible to me.

Please note that I'm not condoning retrofitting like this, just pointing out that it's not as bad as it could've been. It's a pity that these aren't out in separate volumes, as one or two discs would be great for a rental just to see what's what.
I know that LOVEFILM rent out dvd volumes from boxsets.

I assume they would with Bluray too - but the screenshots are enough for me.

£29.99 or 4:3 for me
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Old 27-09-2008, 23:27   #132
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It is up for rental at LoveFilm
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Old 28-09-2008, 15:59   #133
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At first glance the re-framing looks ok, but the more you look at them, the worse they get.
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Old 28-09-2008, 16:09   #134
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There's a little bit of extra picture on the left, but it's not enough to make up for the overall cropping. However seeing as it's likely Thunderbirds will probably only ever be available in 16:9 it's the only HD choice.
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Old 28-09-2008, 17:03   #135
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It is frustrating I agree...but I cannot see ITV redoing the set any time soon, so its a case of take it or leave I think. I will pick up sometime, but no big rush... Like everyone else, a 4:3 is what I want!

Its a lose lose situation, I notice WB released Justice League Bluray in 4:3 and they got slated in every review for having black bars and not just cropping it to take advantage of the format....
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Old 28-09-2008, 17:46   #136
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Its a lose lose situation, I notice WB released Justice League Bluray in 4:3 and they got slated in every review for having black bars and not just cropping it to take advantage of the format....
That's a different situation though -- although originally broadcast in 4:3, Justice League was intended to be shown cropped in 16:9 (this is stated by the producers in the commentaries). So their own preference would have been a widescreen, cropped 16:9 release.

I don't think these old Gerry Anderson series were intended to be viewed cropped in widescreen, unless someone knows otherwise?
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Old 28-09-2008, 17:56   #137
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They were made to be shown on TV at the time. At the time TV happened to be 4:3.

Whether or not one likes it, there's an argument to be made for releasing them cropped to 16:9 for HD. Because that's the way TV is now.

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Old 28-09-2008, 21:07   #138
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They were made to be shown on TV at the time. At the time TV happened to be 4:3.

Whether or not one likes it, there's an argument to be made for releasing them cropped to 16:9 for HD. Because that's the way TV is now.
So you were one of those who were quite happy to see 50% of the picture removed from Cinemascope films on tv when it was 4:3 then?

And you are happy to see 2.35:1 films cropped to 1.85:1 now too?

After all - its the way tv is now

Luckily you are in a minority.

It took years to get films released in widescreen and this bodge job is no different.

There WILL be a 4:3 release of Thunderbirds at some point.

But that could well be 5 years away knowing ITV

I hope Network take advantage od ITV's shortsightedness and are given the opportunity to release the show properly

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Old 28-09-2008, 21:10   #139
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So you were one of those who were quite happy to see 50% of the picture removed from Cinemascope films on tv when it was 4:3 then?
Back when most peoples Tvs were only 20" or less, yes I suppose it didn't bother me.


Quote:

And you are happy to see 2.35:1 films cropped to 1.85:1 now too?
No, but it's a slightly different issue.


Quote:
Luckily you are in a minority.
For a release like Thunderbirds that still has mass appeal, I'm probably not. ITV obviously think they'd get more grief if they didn't release them this way.

Last edited by thescrounger; 28-09-2008 at 21:14.
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Old 28-09-2008, 21:16   #140
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It's not really a different issue at all. You are still losing image to 'fit' the TV. It's crap.
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